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General health problems such as ear infections, pink eye and influenza affect nearly every person eventually. Rod Moser, PA, PhD, shares information and advice here on the most common general health disorders, their symptoms, treatments, and prevention.

Wednesday, June 21, 2006

Dirty Places, Part 3: Your Doctor's Office
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Any congregation of ill people should be considered high on the list of dirty places -- hospitals, nursing homes, and yes, your doctor's office. The Centers for Disease Control estimates that nearly two MILLION patients in the U.S. get infections in the hospital, and about 90,000 of these patients DIE as a result of their infections. Serious efforts, including legislation, have been proposed to reduce this terrible toll on human life.

Earlier this week, I spoke with a man on his way to Seattle to see his seriously-ill father. His father has a routine prostate procedure and is now fighting for his life because of a serious hospital-acquired infection.

When my wife had a hysterectomy many years ago, she spent less than a day in the local hospital. Due to my fear of infection, I wanted her home in a cleaner environment. Of course, I was able to stay home and take care of her postsurgical needs, not something everyone is capable of doing. Although a large part of my medical training was in the hospital, the bulk of my career has been in the outpatient arena, so this will be the focus of this entry - getting sick FROM your doctor's office.

In pediatrics, we have both a WELL and a SICK waiting room. We also have an isolated RASH room for children who may have chicken pox, measles, or other infectious diseases.

Although isolating the sick from the well is a good start, I feel really sorry for those parents and kids sitting in on the sick side of our waiting area. There are no rules in medicine that state you can only have one illness at a time. There is always a risk that you will come in with a cold, and go out with diarrhea...if you are not careful. We do not have a sick examination room, and a well examination room. Perhaps, we should.

We are always at odds with our janitorial service. They empty the trash, vacuum and mop the floors, wipe off the counter tops, clean the bathrooms/sinks, etc. every night. If I gave them a grade for those cursory efforts, it would not be a passing one.

Cosmetic cleaning is totally different than disinfection. For instance, if you just wipe off a counter top that had blood and urine specimens sitting on it all day, it does not remove the pathogens. It will take a chemical disinfectant to do that job. It is often left to our busy medical assistants to take this final, critical step. Not only will disinfection protect our patients, they will protect US. Controlling the spread of infectious disease is EVERYONE'S responsibility in the medical office.

When the examining room door closes, I am the one that will see contamination. I am the one that will chastise the Dads for throwing a poopy diaper in the top of the trash can (Mothers know better). I am the one that sees fresh blood on the examining table after checking a child's hemoglobin. So, I am the one that is going to need to properly clean this area after the patient leaves.

My medical assistant is supposed to disinfect the table tops before putting fresh paper on the examination table, but I still ask that the parents lay down their own blanket first when I examine a child. Not only is a blanket warmer and softer than paper, it is cleaner -- or at least, it just has the family's own germs.

It is nearly impossible to contain toddlers, however. Short of duct-taping them to a chair, they will open all drawers, try and dig through the trash can (another reason why diapers should not be in there), and try and put the little fingers in the tongue depressor or cotton ball jar.

Parents usually do a good job with this, but children are natural explorers and touch everything. My own two-year old once came in carrying a dog turd in his hand, telling me that people should never eat poop (A good rule). That little boy is now an RN in the emergency room.

I estimate that I wash my hands about 150 times per day. I wash them in front to the parents so they know it did it; after seeing their child, and again, after I leave the room just for added insurance. Additionally, I use an alcohol-based hand sanitizer.

I go through a forest of paper towels every day. In spite of my own efforts to avoid spreading microorganisms to myself and to other patients, I suspect it happens. I gave up wearing my wonderful collection of pediatric neckties after I realized that I drag it across a fair number of babies, many of which grab and chew on it.

I use alcohol swabs on my stethoscope, knowing of course, that it would take HOURS of soaking in alcohol to kill every viral or bacterial pathogen. I choose not to wear a white lab coat since I think it scares the children, but I worry about my contaminated clothes at the end of the day.

I think that I do the best that I can, but there is still ample room for improvement. Instinctively, I know that people (especially kids) are germ-magnets, so there is only so much we can do as medical providers. The rest is up to the patient or parent.

  1. Assume that many things in your doctor's office are contaminated: the arms of the chairs, door knobs, faucet handles, etc. By knowing these "hot zones", you can try to avoid them, or know that you will need to wash your own and children's hands.
  2. Contain your children into a safe zone where you can watch them. As natural as it is for them to be social, a doctor's office is not the place to socialize with potentially-ill children. Children are very curious, so keep them from rifling through the drawers and exploring other dangerous places.
  3. Bring toys, games, books, etc. for the kids from home so that they will have something to do. Waiting room toys have been eliminated from our office to reduce the spread of infectious disease.
  4. Wash everyone's hands once you get to the examining room; wash them again after you leave the office.
  5. Keep in mind that most pathogens enter the body via the nose or eyes, so avoid rubbing or touching these areas with contaminated hands.


Related Topics: (WebMD Video) The Dirty Truth on Handwashing, (WebMD Video)C Diff: Common Infection is Acquired in Hospitals

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If you're just now joining us, you'll want to read Public Toilets (part 1) and Airplanes (part 2).

Posted by: Rod Moser_PA_PhD at 10:25 AM

38 Comments:

Blogger lilmama said...

I COULDN'T AGREE WITH YOU MORE-SPEAKING FROM AN MA WHO WORKS IN A DR.'S OFFICE! I CONSTANTLY WASH MY HANDS, DISINFECT, AND USE HAND SANITIZER! THEN, ONCE I GET HOME, I SHED THE SCRUBS-AND I SCRUB!!

Jun 22, 2006 8:42:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thank you for this article! I too worked in a doctor's office. I must say though, we were fanatical about room disinfecting AND bathroom disinfecting. Many patients had Hepatitis! It was rewarding though, to have patient after patient comment on ours being the "cleanest" doctor's office they had ever visited. :-)
Darn right!

JWright, Phx, AZ

Jun 25, 2006 6:09:00 PM  
Anonymous rhonda laine said...

Dear Dr. Moser
Im a deaf in one ear left one.
it is decible damage and the cops in Pinellas county are have a scozophrinic night mare for some of us I also have a xray of the damamage via a panaramic xray i am not even going to jail or anything. Let me put it this way they denied med treatment to escape punitive damages. I can breath bubbles through my left nostrail and my left ear it is a pain in the but and they try consitley to heal this with jesus crist which made my deaf person athiest in ant case what is it called when you get air into your nose and ears. Thanks Rhonda Laine Largo Florida

Jun 27, 2006 8:48:00 PM  
Blogger Judy said...

When my husband was hospitalized several years ago, I discovered that he was always assigned the same nurse as the patient in the adjacent room with the large MARO (Multiple Antibiotic Resistant Organism) sign on the door.

I allowed them to hand him his medications and, reluctantly, to take his vital signs. Other than that, I didn't allow anyone to touch him or even to change his bed linens. I was obnoxious if I didn't see someone wash their hands, too. I'm sure they thought I was nuts, but he made it out of the hospital (post CABG) infection free.

Jun 28, 2006 2:16:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have had several major surgeries. So far I have always come out AOK but, I have had friends who have not fared well. I worry about infection every time I go in for procedure. There are real horror stories lurking there. I also am very careful about what I touch at the doctors office. I make sure I wash my hands very well when I leave.

Jun 28, 2006 10:02:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My father was a doctor and he had the sniffles a lot!

Jun 30, 2006 10:32:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

If the water from a public splashes up and makes contact with the skin or anus, can that spread disease?

Jul 1, 2006 3:58:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The MOST disgusting habit that many people have (including doctors and other health care professionals as well as the general public) is licking a finger to wet it in order to turn a page or pick up a piece of paper. There are many diseases which are very contagious (Hepatitis C especially) that are asymptomatic. I would hate to be handed something from someone who had just touched it with their saliva ladened finger

Jul 1, 2006 11:44:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The manager at our bank was hospitalized in the Intensive Care Unit over labor day some years ago. She was in an isolation unit for several days and needed life support. She survived only because her Doctor was proactive and recogonized that her illness was severe and demanded imediate actions. The State Department contacted her husband to find out when she had been to Africa as what ever she had come from there. She never left the States. She got the infection from handling cash at the bank. All the tellers now use hand sanitizer several times a day.

Jul 2, 2006 11:31:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am a housekeeper in a large hospital, and I can assure you that not only is my unit clean, but so are my cleaning supplies.

Thanks for the info.

BTW< I do work very hard to keep it that way.

Jul 2, 2006 4:51:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Perspective of a Substitute Teacher:
Much would be missed in life without being touched and touching others including pets. I believe it is prudent to sanitize imediately afterwards. I also practice touchings suspect surfaces with appendages with which I am unlikely to inoculate myself, (feet, forearms ect..)
When leaving the B.room use the drying towel to open the door then toss it. Last school year I recieve no flu shot nor any flu. I recomend 90% organic veggie diet, regular P.E., sufficient sleep, sunlight,
socializing, low toxic intake and hand sanitizer.

Jul 2, 2006 5:44:00 PM  
Blogger Skankster said...

such a fabulous doctor.
You sound like a great person and I am glad to hear you take such responsibility.

Keep up the good work.

Jul 2, 2006 11:05:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am an LPN in an Internal Med. clinic. I sanitize the chair arms, the BP cuff, the table, the computer, the counter and the doorknobs after each patient leaves the room.

Jul 3, 2006 12:33:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am a registered nurse in a hospital. I definitely notice times when colleagues should have washed their hands and don't. Many of the doctors that make rounds in the mornings going from patient room to patient room don't wash their hands in between. I definitely will be washing my hands more often.

Jul 7, 2006 11:23:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Working as a housekeeper we do what we can to keep things clean. However, you can not beleive what some of the families of patients do to the rooms either!!

Jul 8, 2006 6:20:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And don't forget to be especially careful not to use the toilet in the lab. I know I got a horrific infection when I had to give a urine specimen. I wouldn't recommend using any toilet facility near the lab! Why do you think that signs posted on some bathroom doors state " Employees only!!"

Jul 8, 2006 7:19:00 AM  
Blogger tailspin said...

i certainly have no quarrel with any and all advice and comments in this column...however, after watching and participating in life for quite some time now, i have to say it appears to me that in this area, as well as so many others, there is a phobia that is infecting nearly everyone in this country...think about it...always safe and looking to be safer first and foremost in all things...so when do we enjoy anything?...i personally have concluded that the vast majority of people will survive just about anything, including touching each other, eating all the horrible things we do, smoking, and whatever else you want to talk about...and yes, that might mean we die at 70 or 80 instead of making it to 110...but you know, i just can't think of how that is all bad...again, i agree with the commentary, as it just makes good sense...but it sure makes a large part of our 24-hour day a miserable, unproductive, and relentlessly boring and tedious affair...

Jul 8, 2006 8:21:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

In some ways I agree, I watched a check out person in a grocery store sneeze into his hands, wipe them on his shirt then continue checking out groceries. Thank god Iwas not in his lane. When my wife was in a hospital for a long peroid there waas a piece of dirt on the floor, I watched that for weeks and it was still there when she left. Another time after surgery the surgon came to check up droped an instrment on the floor, picked it up and kept on with the exam. She got a staphy infection that time and extended the hospital stay. However I wonder how I lived to be 81 years old, we did not go around wiping every thing, I sure played in alot of dirt, a cut was fixed with iodine and back to play. I had a bad cut fixed on the kitchen table, no specil stuff used. I lived. I think some is good, you need to watch carefully but some get carried away.

Jul 8, 2006 12:56:00 PM  
Blogger nogermsplease said...

I love the way you use humor to make your points!
After reading many of the replys, I noticed that no one mentioned using the writing pens in hospitals, doctor's offices, grocery and retail stores, ect. With all the germs these must carry, they are certain instruments of potential danger! I always use my own.

Jul 8, 2006 4:29:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The very worst time to read a magazine is in the doctors office waiting room. Especially the ones that have been there since Clinton was president. Can you imagine just what is on the magazines.
I bring my own or just doze until the doc gets ready for me. Not a bad idea to bring a childs own book instead of reading the childrens books there. Anyone that is in the docs waiting room is there because they are SICK.

Jul 8, 2006 6:00:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I used to work in a grocery store, and now work in a small market/deli store. I very rarely get sick, maybe a high immune system does help, but I constantly wash my hands at work, and at home, and I clean doorknobs. All and any type of cleaning does help.

Jul 8, 2006 7:03:00 PM  
Anonymous Howard said...

Two years ago my doctor ordered a peripheral artery test for me at a local hospital. In this test they attach large blood pressure cuffs sround your thighs and inflate them. You take the test wearing undershorts and a hospital gown( at least I did at that hospital). About 4 or 5 days later I started itching in the pubic and anal region. Upon checking I found that I had a wonderful case of Crab Lice (Crabs,an STD.). I was furious and embrassed so I went to the hospital and told them as quietly as possible that I had gotten crabs from there lab. They told me that this could not have happened and intimated that I had picked it up my self by having illicit sex. A couple of bottles of NIX later and all was under control but had to wash all clothes,bed clothes, spray carpets furniture etc. Not nice.

Jul 8, 2006 8:45:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

His patients should be thankful that they take their chidren to this doctor. At least there is one healthcare professional who is concerned about transmission of diseases! If all others could be convinced to wash their hands often!

Jul 8, 2006 10:18:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The last time I was in the hospital(for colitis that time) the nurse who inserted my IV didn't wash his hands nor did he wear gloves. Once when I had a cyst removed in the doctor's office, he dropped something on the floor and did not wash his hands or change gloves after retrieving it. The "one stitch" surgery got infected and I had to return to have several stitches and have the incision packed and treated. I feel self concious saying anything. I do assure you, however that from now on I WILL speak up.

Jul 8, 2006 11:35:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My daughter contracted a staph infection after gastric by-pass surgery at a local hospital and was not informed about it. We found out about it after we recieved her medical records. By outward appearences, the hospital looked spotless. I think they should have to inform the patient if something like this happens. Thank you for the great article.

Jul 9, 2006 10:18:00 AM  
Anonymous Robert R Sloan said...

I am surprised that noone has mentioned the common problem of bathrooms. Sanitation in public and restaurant (fastfoods included) bathrooms is generally very bad. from entering to exiting:

1 Most bathroom doors push in allowing one to enter bu pushing with a shoulder and not touching the handle, but after washing and trying to leave one is required generally to open the door witha handle pull. This contaminates your just washed hands.

2 Even if you wash after using the toilet many restrooms have only blow dryers that require one to push a filthy button (I use my elbow) Then upon leaving there is no paper towel to use to grab the handle to exit.

3 Watch out for restaurants that only have a single bathroom for guests and employees to use. The employees will constantly be carrying filth (feces and other goodies) back to the food work area especially if they have the doors and blow dryers like above. That is if the employees wash their hands at all.

Blow dryers can be more sanitory than paper towels but not if there are no other ways to get in and out of the bathroom

4 If you are in an establishment (grocery store or restaurant) and an employee is sick (sniffling, coughing, or just rubbing their nose, First ask for the manager and tell them that you were going to buy something but you have changed your mind and probably won't come back for a while until the infection has cleared not just from the employee but from the premises. Also tell him that a report to the health department willo be in order if you ever see this again then promptly leave.

5 Beware of stewardesses that have touched many people and the backs of sll the seats that everyone else has touched with snot and mucus on their hands and then gives you food or a drink. All food servers should provide you with a clean wipe to use before and after eating.

6 Don't touch your face without washing you hands first and scrub under the nails silly.

Jul 10, 2006 4:41:00 PM  
Blogger Betty said...

A friend of mine went to the hospital to have a baby. She had a beautiful baby, but contracted a staph infection and died. She left a beautiful baby and two young toddlers. There's a lesson to be learned here. Too bad it came with such a high price.

Jul 12, 2006 9:01:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Guess what? There are germs in hospitals. Guess why? BECAUSE SICK PEOPLE GO THERE! Though hospitals take extraordinary care to prevent infections, and even have Infection Control Departments, nobody can be guaranteed that a visit to a hospital means you will go home germ-free. Take sensible precautions. And DON'T bring your kids into a hospital, unless they are the patient!

Jul 17, 2006 9:50:00 PM  
Blogger Bill said...

Has anyone visiting a doctor's waiting room wonder how many times each of the magazines have been handled by sick individuals? I bring my own reading materials.....Bill

Jul 20, 2006 4:46:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Help! I have a 7 month old baby boy who has been diagnost with c-fiff three times within one month. He has been placed on vancomycin also Flagyl antibiotics. But no clearing in sight. Has anyone ever heard of such a thing? Any suggestions ?
jjta95@yahoo.com please write c-diff in title.

Mar 15, 2007 4:15:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The same logic applies to public restrooms & restaurants. My good friend got Herpes (oral) from using a glass in a restaurant that was not sanitized properly. On another occasion I watched a guy at the "new york bagel" shop in San Ramon cut his finger on a knife, lick the blood and then he kept working on my bagel without hand washing or getting a band-aid for the bloody finger. Needless to say, I told him to take my bagel and shove it! If you run or work in a restaurant or public facility...REMIND YOUR EMPLOYEES and Co-WORKERS TO USE GOOD SANITARY HYGENE. It can prevent the spread of disease.

Apr 29, 2007 1:19:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have had several operatioins in the last year or so. I have been feeling ill for some time. I found out I have an staph infection. I was wondering how long this could have been in my body. My skin got weird, like chunking off easly and my vision was going fast? I couldn't go to the restroom hardly at all? I am on my 6 day of antibiotic with a sore still on my face. I am allergic to bactrum and I am on keflex 500 mg. I had several reoccurances of impentaigo, I thought it was a cold sore. But I was wrong. Should I be more concerned about the length of time this infection has been in my body? My last surgery was a little over a year ago.

Sep 28, 2007 2:39:00 PM  
Anonymous Meghan said...

I know for a fact another place of mass germs is college dorms. This is my first year at college and within the first week I had a common cold. I found out that this most likely came from the bathroom blow dryer/door handle. I got another one at the end of September. This one came from what everybody else around me had. I've been her almost two months and so far people have had strep, broncitis, upper respiratory infection, viral infection, food poisining, allergic reactions from something in the showers, mono, microplasma, diarrhea, and constipation. I now don't use the hand dryer, hand sanitize every day, take a multi-vitamin, use clorox wiped, and spray lysol. Hopefully I can make it to thanksgiving when I go home without getting sick again.

Oct 19, 2007 12:02:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am concerned about germs at Cracker barrel.The peg games on tables.They are thrown on the floor after first being in childrens mouths.I have seen the pegs swept into dust pan taken out and put back on table.I yhink policy should be,wash the pegs or get rid of game.

Jan 7, 2008 8:48:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

One problem that I have has to do with buffet lines in restaurants like Shoneys. I have seen children and adults leaning over the food and touching with their hands. Who knows what germs drip from their noses as they lean over or where their hands have been before touching the food! We have started shying away from the "serve yourself" buffets.

Mar 6, 2008 9:18:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

i agree this is is nuts how dirty the doc`s office is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Apr 30, 2008 10:46:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

hi every one

Apr 30, 2008 10:47:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think my daugter ingested some human fecal matter what should i do? Is there any serious risks to ingesting it?

Apr 9, 2009 9:32:00 AM  

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