From the Sex Files: Lowered Expectations
Today in my therapy office I had a session with a man who had decided that he was going to accept his situation and lower his expectations about his wife. Normally, I'm a fan of people reducing their strenuous expectations of their mate and getting more reality into the picture. Today I felt differently.
I had worked with this man for a little over a year. He initially had come in to discuss his concerns about his own sexual functioning. He wanted to learn to last longer. Among the information I had offered him was the useful book by Jacob Williams, Premature Ejaculation: New Hope for an Old Problem. We had discussed issues such as anxiety, self-acceptance, and not viewing sex as a performance.
But what had led him into my office after a twenty-year marriage? It turned out that he was there because he wanted to last longer with an extramarital partner.
During the course of the year, the secretive sex with this woman came to an end. She was married also and had entered therapy with her husband to try to work it out. There were some restarts between them and some more stops, but ultimately it ended several months ago. We continued to meet and pondered his sexual coming of age and his beliefs about sexuality now. At heart, he was a fairly romantic person. Yet, today we ran into one of the problems of a certain kind of romantic image of sexuality.
Throughout his whole life, he had wanted to be with a woman who really desired him - desire that did not fade over time. His wife's sexual frequency had dwindled when kids were added to their lives - like nearly every couple. The rejection he experienced during those years were pretty discouraging and had led him to feel that there was little hope of his ever finding this type of sexual intimacy with his wife.
Yet, the kids were now much more independent. I encouraged him to approach his wife again with any one of the following questions and statements:
But when I suggested some of the practical ways to begin to have a conversation with his wife, not about his affair, but about his dilemma - he realized that having the courage to go out on his personal ledge was more than he thought he could do. I wasn't asking that he reveal the affair, just that he try to change the things in his relationship that had led him there.
He said, "Maybe I don't have the courage." Throughout our sessions, he often said that he didn't want to push his wife. I agreed that pushing wasn't likely to bring them closer together. But inviting his wife's interest and curiosity in something that mattered to him would not be pushing.
I said that if he had been my husband, I surely would have wanted a chance to consider the things that interested him, that relying on her answers from a decade ago wasn't really doing her justice. He said that he would think it over. But, I sensed that he had really decided to lower his expectations and that would be his solution - that and perhaps another affair.
Related Topics: Technorati Tags: sex, marriage, passion
I had worked with this man for a little over a year. He initially had come in to discuss his concerns about his own sexual functioning. He wanted to learn to last longer. Among the information I had offered him was the useful book by Jacob Williams, Premature Ejaculation: New Hope for an Old Problem. We had discussed issues such as anxiety, self-acceptance, and not viewing sex as a performance.
But what had led him into my office after a twenty-year marriage? It turned out that he was there because he wanted to last longer with an extramarital partner.
During the course of the year, the secretive sex with this woman came to an end. She was married also and had entered therapy with her husband to try to work it out. There were some restarts between them and some more stops, but ultimately it ended several months ago. We continued to meet and pondered his sexual coming of age and his beliefs about sexuality now. At heart, he was a fairly romantic person. Yet, today we ran into one of the problems of a certain kind of romantic image of sexuality.
Throughout his whole life, he had wanted to be with a woman who really desired him - desire that did not fade over time. His wife's sexual frequency had dwindled when kids were added to their lives - like nearly every couple. The rejection he experienced during those years were pretty discouraging and had led him to feel that there was little hope of his ever finding this type of sexual intimacy with his wife.
Yet, the kids were now much more independent. I encouraged him to approach his wife again with any one of the following questions and statements:
"Do you ever want to know more about me and what I think?"We talked about the courage that it would take to offer these words. I had told him that it takes real courage to want to connect deeply, intimately, and sexually. Few people can really handle it. Allowing someone to mean that much can be a personally risky position. It's difficult to handle knowing that there's one person who matters that much to you. He said, "Like going out on a ledge." So, theoretically, he understood.
"I want you to get to know me more."
"I'd like to get to know you more."
"I'd like to last longer during sex. I've read this book. Would you be willing to read it also?"
But when I suggested some of the practical ways to begin to have a conversation with his wife, not about his affair, but about his dilemma - he realized that having the courage to go out on his personal ledge was more than he thought he could do. I wasn't asking that he reveal the affair, just that he try to change the things in his relationship that had led him there.
He said, "Maybe I don't have the courage." Throughout our sessions, he often said that he didn't want to push his wife. I agreed that pushing wasn't likely to bring them closer together. But inviting his wife's interest and curiosity in something that mattered to him would not be pushing.
I said that if he had been my husband, I surely would have wanted a chance to consider the things that interested him, that relying on her answers from a decade ago wasn't really doing her justice. He said that he would think it over. But, I sensed that he had really decided to lower his expectations and that would be his solution - that and perhaps another affair.
Related Topics: Technorati Tags: sex, marriage, passion
20 Comments:
Oh gosh, that is so sad. He's not lowering his expectations, he's just giving up. He didn't face the situation when their sex life dwindled in the beginning and preferred to take a lover and now that he has another chance he's not taking it. How dreadfully sad.
What a waste ...
That is very sad. It is possible to lower your standards to some extent and try and better things between you and your partner. In the beginning of my relationship with my current partner i was married and we were having threesomes. It was great. I was extremely sexually satisfied. Then my husband left and i stayed with my partner. Even though some of the issues he'd had during the threesomes (lose of erection, performance anxiety) dissapeared he seemed less interested in having passionate sex. He was happy with just quickes.
For many months i struggled with this. I flirted like no bodies business in hopes of getting him interested. I tried initiating and being enthusiatic. But he still seemed disinterested. I became very depressed and began to deattach. I finally gathered the courage to have a long honest talk about everything. We were able to understand each others points of view better than we ever had. We were both acting under misconceptions. Our passionate, "kinky", no holds barred sex still doesnt happen all the time, but it happens often enough for me to be satisfied and know that he really does care. So, sometimes an honest conversation and lowering your expectations a bit can be benificial.
My fiancee isn't interested in coitus,all she likes is oral gratification and stimulation via device. She is heavy and it is difficult to penetrate. She preferes a vibration device -then she rolls over and within 5-10 minutes she is sound asleep. I know the female enjoys the cuddling and afterglow, but , I like it as well-she's disinterested in contact. At least I enjoy some of the afterglow,-but after she's consumated-the TV goes off and it's over.ZZZZZZZZZZZ
why dont they have a pill for women like they do for men to help our sex drive.
Mam, a v useful discussion u had with this man. is it possible 4 me to seek ur advice on my personal problem, if so pls tell me how?
dr_muzzamil@hotmail.com
I agree with the one person...WHY don't they make a pill for women
I have to say I am also sexually and physically at a stalemate.. its a good pun tho.. I am so bored I dont even bother getting into it with my husband I let him satisfy himself but me? Engaging and becoming frustrated with overwhelming desire is no fun either. I am a faihtful wife. I long for kissing touching stroking but there's nothing just "what position" I can't stand having sex with him. He's gone all the time he works in the oilfield... he says he shouldn't have to do anything for me to be exicted I should just be. And he waits all month so he can come home and be with me well Im waiting too and its nothing to wait for.. I dream of a lover and of the feelings that lovemaking bring... I feel like a prostitute just hoping he will finish fast- he's bigger than I like too so it just hurts and the way he moves is just awful if I have to I make noises just to help him along... (he can't distinguish between pain and pleasure) fighting over it isnt worth it talking to him doesnt work he just doesnt want to listen- he is a good man and he works for me I dont have to which is a relief for me... but he says he doesnt want to do anything while hes at home and it includes our sex life its just for him nothing for me. Hes a minute man or hes hurting me because he wants it to feel a certain way for him. Gosh I hate sex now I want it sooo bad and I just cant cheat.... I cant stand looking at porn masturbation well its not that fulfilling.. I used to have a great sex life I wish i hadnt so i wouldnt know what I was missing his response is to find someone else to satisfy those desires just dont let him know about it. BUT I CANT!
I think lowering your expectations can be empowering. Try to meet your own needs first and anything else is a bonus. And you are in control. I am starting perimenopause and have all kinds of issues with that. I have discovered erotic fiction. It's entertaining, puts me in the mood, and helps with dryness that can occur with perimenopause. There is nothing wrong with masturbation. Your mate can even watch or you can watch your mate. There are some great tools out there on the internet. Opening yourself up and taking risks can lead to intimacy, if you let it.
If you want to have a happy marriage, stop thinking about yourself and intstead focus on your partner. Happy spouse...happy home. And don't be afraid to let your guard down or take risks. Real, passionate love making (not sex) is a patient, gratifying approach to ensure your partner is satisfied. If so, good things will fall into place.
What is he talking about? Nothing was said as to how long did he want to last. Does he now go 5 minutes with his partner or 20. Men need to know these things. Much is said about pre-mature ejaculation but not much is said about what exactly it is. Professionals need to set the standards regarding this issue instead of always talking around it.
I understand this man's position. I am going through the same situation, but I don't feel like I suffer from pre-mature ejaculation. His wife's lack of intimacy makes him feel like he isn't good enough for her to desire having sex with him. Maybe she's bored with him or she desires a man with more to offer in the sack than him. She could be having an affair with another man to try and fulfill some sexual fantasies that he can't. Maybe she has never had an orgasm with him and is frustrated at not having experienced it. Whatever the reasons, I have found through personal experience that it more than likely isn't his fault. He will find that the harder he tries, the worse it will get. I am still trying to find out the reasons with my spouse through counseling. I did find that she was calling another man daily for the last 3 years behind my back. She denied this when I confronted her, but I had telephone records that said different. She had already had an affair early in our marraige also. He needs to sit back and make a hard decision. Does he want to reconcile with his wife and find out the true problem? This takes being up front and a lot of patience. Communication needs to be 2-way. More importantly, does his wife want to change? You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink. It could be a lost cause. He needs to figure out if he wants to continue with the relationship or ask for a divorce. He may be happier if they go their separate ways. A friend asked me once, "Do you want to spend another 22 years in a relationship without intimacy?" Of course I don't I said. This man needs to decide if he wants that too. As far as his sexual performance. A man should be able to go more than one or two times. He should be able to go at least 4-6 times if he's in his 40's. Your mouth and hands always work. If you aren't able to give pleasure at the moment with one, give it with another. Incorporate a toy if you need to. Men should be able to last longer with each go round. They should communicate with their partner to find out what they like and don't like. Every woman is different. Find out what your's wants from you. That's the joy of sex. You can experiment with your partner to discover ways to provide the utmost pleasure to them. Don't get stuck in the same rut of missionary position, going one time, rolling over, and going to sleep. Find out if they have any fantasies they would like to make a reality with you (ex. places to have sex, role playing, etc.). Hope this helps some, but my ideas haven't helped me yet. My wife and I still haven't been intimate even after a couple months of counseling.
After 33 years of "pretty good" sex within a marriage, I decided I needed more passion. I found lover who orgasmed repeatedly and let me know how good I was at stimulating her. This went on for 6 years, until my wife found out. After the initial shock and feelings that went with it, she suddenly turned into the kind of partner I was looking for! She now lets me know that she wants sex from me, and we make love several times a week, sometimes more than once a day! We have talked about what happened, and it seems that she is finally giving herself permission to be a sexual person. We have explored my reasons for having an affair, and I am working on some issues that led to it. We don't want to give any credit to the affair, but in some strange way, it has made my wife a much more sexual person!
To the people who want a pill for women: Viagra doesn't increase libido, it only makes performance possible. So much of sex is in the mind. I take Viagra, but since my wife is so responsive, I don't need it as often. Her heightened desire has nothing to do with a drug, only with a change in her attitude.
Wow, This topic has sure been turned over at all angles. I understand this man. In a marriage you learn what battles you can fight & win. You also know what battles you cannot win that will turn into a full fledged war zone. There are a lot of tv shows that make fun of how our home situations fit this. Men, do not like to rock the boat at home and so we find a compromise that we can live with. Sex drive is one of those things that make this harder to do. I think if most men would be honest they will tell you that they would like to have their sex needs met with their wife. We do know the difference between fantasy and reality. They would also have to tell you that it is easier to cheat with another women then to try to get their wife to change how she is looking at this side of the relationship. Women either think they are being used and not appreciated when sex is brought up or that we are saying they cannot satisfy us. It makes it a lose, lose situation for the man. It ends up being frustrating for the woman also but nobody is wanting to rock the boat enough to fix the problem. The man may try a couple of times and then it is easier to return a smile from a stranger who has shown an interest as this is more safe then bringing war into the home. The end result is that divorce is the growing trend as people do not want to look at needs as a responsibility of the partner anymore. Instead they want to look at it as a selfish action on the part of the man. I understand this as I am there myself. My desire is for my wife to care enough to meet me half way...to just knock the edge off of my need so that I do not look to someone else to do this for me. I do not mind doing anything to help put my wife in the mood. Still, flowers, trips, and other gifts end up being looked at as payment instead of romance. This makes her feel cheap as if we think we have bought them for the night. What is a man to do when communication is not allowed on this subject without putting war into the home?
Ultimately, he was selfish. He was more concerned with his perceptions of his wife's rejection of him than in giving her another chance. What is it about men that makes them think they are the only ones who are dissatisfied?
My husband hasn't touched me for nearly 11 years. Do you think I am happy about that? I am in a committed relationship, though, and when I try to discuss this with him, he just hurts me more my telling me that he loves me but just can't. It is unfair to me and to himself. He has been this way since I went through a very difficult pregnancy with our daughter. Following her birth we were both exhausted even more because we had to care for his critically-ill mother AND our newborn. He hasn't given me a chance. He rejects me based on the fact that the very difficult pregnancy changed my body (and I have worked so hard to fix this myself). He says he can't find me attractive anymore. What is wrong with a man when the woman he is married to is so attracted to him and always has been and he just can't even allow himself to reciprocate?? I can only wait and hope. Talking gets us nowhere. He is British and very "stiff upper lip", and they just DON'T talk about these things. What to do? I could use some advice.
I think Bill is right. Men don't go looking for affairs. They may blow a lot of smoke with their buddies, but they would rather have sex with their wife. If you don't take care of your man, he will stray. I think that is true of women also.
My advice to the woman that hasn't had sex in 11 years is to get a private investigator. A man can't go without sex for 11 years unless he is severely depressed or something along those lines. Chances are he is having an affair if he's made comments about not finding you attractive any more. He's stringing you along. You've given him chances again and again for 11 years. He probably tells you that there is nothing wrong with him too. It's not your fault. Don't put any blame on yourself. You are probably just as attractive as you ever were. He is the one that has a problem whatever it may be. It sounds like you've made every effort to become the attractive woman you feel he would desire. Now work on being the woman You want to be. You have to be able to communicate in order to resolve the problem. Try seeing if he will go with you to counseling. It's time to do something different from what you've been doing. It's not fair to you to spend the rest of your life without intimacy. Especially if he may be having an affair. Good luck! I hope you can work it out with him. Don't wait too long though. There is a point of no return.
Wow, this story could be about me and my husband. After two years of counseling I did approach him about trying to become more intimately connected, both emotionally and sexually. And while he would love more sex, he has no interest in knowing me or sharing more about himself. This lack of intimacy is killing our marriage, not the lack of sex. He has refused counseling so I have given up!
After a 30+ year marriage of rejection, and public embarassment from a wife who is a "touch-me-not", and doesn't see much point in good personal grooming, I had an affair. The other woman was also married with many of the same frustrations I had experienced. We really fell for each other, and loved being together, even if it was just for lunch, or just sit and visit openly. Her husband found out about us and now rules her like a slave. She did not want the public embarassment of a divorce because of our religious beliefs. I have tried to lower my expectations with my wife, but it is just a false show to try and keep from hurting her feelings. My heart is still with the other woman and I struggle to get through each day because her husband has convinced her she will got to he** if she even talks with me. I wonder how long I can keep this up? With other woman we both really enjoyed sex together when we did have sex. We both could orgasm several times in one session, and then just enjoy snuggling together. I haven't felt any of those desires with my wife for 25 years. I'm at a lose what to do, stay in my mariage of 30+ years and continue to "fake-it", or go through the results of a divorce.
This is sad, but I'd like to say that many times a wife isn't interested in sex with her husband because her husband has done something that hurts her deeply and the painful event was never resolved, nor did the husband ever express remorse or regret. My husband has had sexual encounters with many women over the years, starting 4 or 5 years into our marriage when he announced he wasn't going to wear his wedding ring any more and started going to bars with his single work friends. I had two babies, couldn't earn a decent living, and either had to accept the situation and try to do the best I could, or move on and expose my children to poverty and life without their father. Did I lose interest in making passionate love to my husband even though I loved him and still do? I think you can guess the answer. It feels too vulnerable to open myself to him in that way, because I fear that another hurtful revelation of infedelity will surface and it hurts less if I can remain somewhat detached. I also think about the other women and womder how he compares me to them, and all the other thoughts that go through your mind after your spouse has cheated. Now he blames my lack of passion for his interest in sex with other women. He conveniently forgets that he is the one who broke our vows, and started us down this slippery slope. I think we may be headed for divorce now if therapy doesn't resolve the wounded pain that I still feel deeply, because I've finally realized that I deserve better and now I don't even want sex of any kind with my husband. I only have to worry about myself since my children have been on their own for a long time, and I can take care of myself. It breaks my heart to even think about it, but there must be something deeply wrong with a man who can inflict so much pain on a woman that he claims to love, and still blame her for it. It's as if he has no clue because he has been so busy justifying his actions, probably to soothe his own guilt. I really need for him to express remorse and understanding about our situation before I am willing to work on any other problems, such as sexual ones.
Much of what has been said here applies to me. I would do pretty much anything for my wife but feel like I am unimportant to her. She lavishes all her time and affection on the kids. I appreciate this but want some too. She will not talk about sex but says it is "something you do, not something you talk about". She out and out refuses to become aroused and basically says "hurry up" whenever we have sex including during foreplay. Sex is becoming less and less frequent. I have never had an affair or anything remotely close to it. I help with the cooking and housework and kid schlepping. I work two jobs so she can be there for the kids. I feel she has been unfaithful, not by having an affair, but by not caring about me. I spend half my time miserable because we have sex so infrequently (about once every ten days). She refuses to see a counselor with me. She says it si my fault. She came from a broken home and in some ways isn't to blame. I find myself wishing that one of us would be killed in a car accident - no one to blame but I would be out of this situation either way. If I bring up discussing things she becomes angry and refuses or says that our house isn't big enough or that we don't go on vacation often enough. I am by nature kind and friendly and generous but this doesn't seem to attract here interest. After a week I become a monster and say mean things. A day or so later we have "hurry up" sex. This pattern repeats over and over and over. I am at my wits end. I know I do much more for my wife than my father or father-in-law ever did for theirs and feel I get little regard in return. Are all American women like this? I don't know. I expected that she would care if I am happy or not. Apparently not. If not for the kids I would leave her today. I find myself still loving her sometimes but it becomes less and less. Maybe I am just a crappy person.
maybe she's lost interest because of the way he treats her. I had an active sex drive but my husband's regular small digs about my body and his lack of personal grooming for me when he'd go all out for others ate at my attraction to him. He was always slightly overweight to overweight. He left because he said he wasn't happy. During counseling he could not list a single reason that justified divorce under our state's law. He's filing after the min year is up. But unless he owns up to his own actions and subtle ways of devaluing his significant other - be it wife or girlfriend - he'll never be happy. Few would say that my wish that he remember me at Christmas on my birthday or our anniversay is asking too much.
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